|
"Two wars are in an endless state of sorrow. Egypt about burned to the ground, and all you people care about is my bulls**t... [It's] pathetic... Shame, shame, shame." He may be a raving crackhead, but through the coke-hazed ramblings a valid point or two is occasionally made.
Hello Mark,
Yes. Thanks for that quote. That really is to the point. It's appalling how many American
people distract themselves with trivial bullshit like the matings and squabbles and foibles
of Hollywood personalities, while ignoring the big picture.
Meanwhile, the oil is running out and nobody is doing anything
about it. We haven't had a serious attempt at preparing for the future since Ronald
Reagan cancelled all of Jimmy Carter's alternative energy projects.
Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer's Disease. What is those other people's problem?
It's like Nero fiddling while Rome burns. Except that this time, it's a large percentage
of the American people fiddling.
Have a good day.
== Orange
Just read the article of Bill Wilson, I am a sober member of AA over 32 Years, I thank God for Bill Wilson and his wicked ways, for if I had not been able to identified with Bill, I may not be here today sober. I went through hell in my early sobriety with my sex addition, I am not cured but a hell of a lot better thanks to Bill W. I was wondering after reading this that was written about Bill, Why do these people that try to destroy Bill, "What are they so afraid of". The whole article is showing nothing but fear all the way through. "WHAT ARE YOU AFRAID OF?" That he will one day be known as one of the GREAT changers of 20th Century that helped more people then you spineless littler article does to harm him, I say spineless, Because I don not respect anyone trying to make themselves look good by writing about a man that is dead and cannot defend himself. I have been in AA long enough to know how people can judge your actions. Mine god the only regret I have is that I didn't screw all the women that people had me screwing, every time I walked out the door with a woman they had me screwing her. I could write a whole book on the virgins I had make in AA, But all they pages would be bland. I was 32 when I came to AA and now that would be old compared to how young people are coming to AA now, but I found out that it wasn't only the men that did 13 stepping the women did it also. Less than 90 days in the program and I either screwed or be approached by just about every female in the AA club I was going to. So don't just blame the men, women do it also, but when a woman gets involved with a newcomer male or female these days, no one is upset, but let a male do the same and he is the worst person there is. Just had to write, because I do get upset when I see how some are writing about Bill and if he was still alive it would be different, I for one do respect anyone who writes about a person that who has done so much to help thousands of men and women to recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body, Only if you have ever lived in the hell of alcoholism will you ever understand what Bill has done, Thank God Bill was not a saint, are you? Gene L. Tampa, FL
Hello Gene,
Wow, you really drank the koolaid, didn't you?
Talk about reversal of reality. The "Friends of Bill" have already tried to pass off
Bill Wilson as "the greatest social architect of the 20th century", but it
didn't work. People are becoming increasingly aware of what a hoax A.A. really is,
and what a failure it is.
That line, "What are you afraid of?" is very standard manipulative cult fare.
I got the same line when I decided to not waste my life in Amway.
"What are you afraid of?" As if I was "afraid"
of getting wealth and success from the Amway program.
And
Steve Hassan got the same line
when three Moonies recruiters were
taking him to a Unification Church indoctrination camp in upstate New York.
He asked, "Why are we going there?" and they answered,
"Why, are you afraid?"
I am not afraid of A.A. or Bill Wilson any more than I am afraid of Rev. Jim Jones or
Chuck Dederich or David Koresh or Marshall Herff Applewhite or
Rev. Sun Myung Moon or Swami Prabhupada.
They are all just a bunch of lying phonies and raving nutcases who hurt a lot of people.
I criticize Alcoholics Anonymous because it is just more quack medicine and cult
religion that hurts people more than it helps them.
Thanks for the news that the women in A.A. are sexual predators too.
That's a great recommendation for a religion that is supposed to make you spiritual
and help you to "find God". Not to mention
"acquire faith" and "find sobriety".
Yes, that's one hell of a "self-help group".
(The question is, "Who is helping themselves to what?")
The fact that you encountered some women sexual predators in A.A. does
not make it okay for Bill Wilson or
any current group leader
to be a sexual predator. Two wrongs do not make a right. A.A. was supposed to
be a self-help group devoted to helping sick people to get sober, remember?
A.A. was supposed to be a safe place for sick, confused, cloudy-headed
people to get help, remember?
When the priest of a church screws the alter-boys, that is not okay.
Now, to get down to brass tacks: What is the actual A.A. cure rate?
You can see the answers
here
and
here.
And what is the A.A. death rate? You can see the answer
here.
Any "self-help recovery" organization that has a higher death
rate than its cure rate is not a good helper.
Then you closed with:
You haven't read much of my web site, have you? I have clearly stated many times
that I also went through the hell of alcohol abuse, until
my doctor told me to
quit drinking or die, choose one.
So I know all about the suffering of alcohol addiction.
Claiming that critics of A.A. don't know about alcoholism is another standard cult
dodge. Whether critics "understand" the pain of alcohol addiction
has nothing to do with the A.A. failure rate or fake spirituality.
I clearly understand what Bill Wilson did, and it was criminal and heartless.
And the "special suffering" of alcoholics does not make it
okay to foist quack medicine on sick people.
Your excuse that Bill Wilson was not a saint does not excuse his crimes.
And that is one strange religion you have there, where you thank God
that your founder was not a saint.
Or a prophet. Or in constant contact with God. Or experienced in talking with God.
Or honest. Or truthful. Or faithful. Or a Messenger. Or
"one of the GREAT changers of 20th Century".
Oh well, have a good day anyway.
== Orange
Orange. A video Mike and I made in support of what Charlie Sheen is saying. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbVtWPUgr1M I trust you are well. Jimmy (aka B l A m E)
Hello Jimmy,
Thanks for the tip, and yes, I am well, thank you.
As usual, I'm having troubles viewing videos, but maybe
others can see it.
Have a good day now.
Orange
Hello again, SherwoodE,
Thanks for the tip. That is very interesting. I agree with Trimpey about a lot of
stuff, especially "the Addictive Voice", or "the Beast", which I call
"the Lizard-Brain Addiction Monster".
But I can't agree with his denunciation of alcoholics and addicts as immoral monsters.
His rap there is just as bad as the A.A. guilt-induction routine.
I don't believe that it is a sin or immoral to feel bad and try to fix it and feel better.
The problem is that the readily-available painkillers are really bad, and harmful and
addicting. So suffer in pain, or try to fix it and suffer in pain some more.
Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.
Have a good day now.
== Orange
Hi Orange I hope you are well. I am pleased to announce that Moderation Management (MM) are at last starting meetings in London. The first meeting will take place Sunday 6th March 2.30pm at Islington Unitarian Church 277A Upper Street Islington N1 2TZ (Next to Islington Fire Station), all are welcome. ( The time and venue may change for future meetings) SMART Recovery UK are also holding on-line meetings Sunday nights. Anyone requiring information on MM in the United Kingdom or SMART Recovery UK please contact me on mmnottinghamuk@yahoo.co.uk
Laurence
Hello Laurence,
Thanks for the tip. Thank you for your work, and have a good day.
== Orange
Date: Thu, March 3, 2011 4:44 pm (answered 7 March 2011) Have you heard of placebo controlled studies?
Hello again, Kim,
Yes, I have. One of the strangest of medical research articles to come out lately
found that the effectiveness of placebos was decreasing. That may sound like an
oxymoron, since a placebo is a do-nothing pill, but placebos do have an effect.
If the patient believes that a pill will reduce his pain, then it will.
That is of course subjective, but real nevertheless. In fact, you can argue that
all pain is subjective.
But the latest study found that placebos were not working as well as they used to.
I guess people want real drugs now.
Have a good day.
== Orange
From: "Kim S." Would love to know your credentials "orange."
Well, let me make your day. I have a PhD. from the School of Hard Knox.
I also have more than 50 years of self-education.
And I have 20 years of drinking experience, and 33 years of smoking experience,
and a bunch of years of experience in taking drugs too.
And now I have over 10 years clean and sober, and tobacco-free too.
You can find all of the other
autobiographical information here:
How did you get to where you are?
Have a good day.
== Orange
Oh boy, don't know where to begin with this guy: http://www2.hernandotoday.com/content/2011/feb/26/HANEWSO1-they-lived-in-fear/ Perhaps this part of the article sums it up nicely:
After his arrest, and after Greif's mother was killed, some of those who knew Kalisz spoke to the media. Many said they were shocked to learn of the allegations made against him.
Hello John,
Thanks for the article. Your excerpted quote pretty much says it all.
You know, I feel a sea change. It used to be that you couldn't get the press to
report criminals operating within A.A., no way, no matter what.
A.A. was perfect, the salvation of all alcoholics, and nobody would say a word
against it. When criminals were A.A. members, that fact was just removed from the
article.
Now, the press is telling the truth more and more. That alone can spell out the
death of A.A. If the public ever learns the truth, it's game over.
Have a good day now.
== Orange
[More gosling photos below, here.]
Dear AO = Thanks for sending your research. My experience as a member has been polar opposite to yours in terms of the quantity of the quality. I have been a member for 27 years (sober for 24) and due to my extensive traveling have witnessed AA in action in many differing locales. AA does not say, as you must already know, that it is the only way, but rather "a way" for those who have, sometimes repeatedly, tried to get sober via whatever method and have failed. Who but the most desperate would want to work the steps?!? On an ongoing basis keeping the light of self-examination on motives and behavior; putting character flaws in writing and sharing them with a trusted person and a higher power who though I'm willing to believe exists (which AA suggests is all you need) can't prove does exist; making restitution, financial and personal, for past crimes and cruelties; spending precious time trying to help those who wish to achieve sobriety and in the process receiving no compensation other than the joy one receives by being of service to their fellow humans and possibly ensuring their own sobriety. Who would do all of this but one who has failed miserably at self-imposed sobriety?! If a cancer patient who has been having success with a chemo regimen decides to stop treatment which leads to the cancer flaring out of control threby ending the patient's life, do we blame the treatment for the patients' death. You know where I'm going with this: if a recovering alcoholic is having success staying sober and experiencing an improved quality of life by "working the steps and going to meetings" and using the myriad of tools that AA offers decides to stop doing so and ultimately ends up returning to drinking, do we blame the program for their ill-advised choice? If I were to change one word in the Big Book it would be "rarely" to "never." I, personally, have never seen a person fail who has thoroughly and continuously followed the steps. Conversely, I have many times witnessed people who either never start or at some point stop working the steps, sooner or later return to their alcoholic drinking. Thanks for reading, MM
Hello again, msanglier,
It is nice that you have found pleasant social clubs around the country.
But that is not evidence that A.A. saves the lives of alcoholics.
It is also not evidence that young women do not have problems with
sexual predators.
Yes, A.A. does claim that A.A. is the only way. I've heard that a zillion times.
See this cult test item:
This is standard A.A. condescension, as if nobody would want to be good or spiritual
unless they were forced to by an illness:
There are actually many people in this world who want to be good and moral and ethical,
and who do not need "the lash of alcoholism" to drive them to go join a religion.
There are even good, moral, alcoholics.
The way that A.A. stereotypes
alcoholics and puts them down
is really disgusting. A.A. is no friend of alcoholics.
You are also assuming that Frank Buchman's self-flaggelation routines do something good,
and make people "spiritual" or something.
There is zero evidence to support that assumption. On the contrary,
the 12-Step routine does very bad things, like raise the suicide rate
in alcoholics, and raise the rate of divorces, and raise the rate of
binge drinking. We were just talking about that before. Look
here and
here.
You tried to compare Alcoholics Anonymous to cancer treatment:
Alcoholics Anonymous is not medical treatment; it is cult religion. In fact,
A.A. defenders have repeatedly declared that A.A. is not treatment, and cannot be
judged like a treatment program. For example,
William L. White declared in
Slaying The Dragon: The History of Addiction Treatment and Recovery
in America that
the effectiveness of A.A. in treating alcoholism cannot be determined because
A.A. is not a treatment program and does not keep records (page 176).
But now you are hinting that A.A. is a treatment program. And your assumption
that the treatment is successful is without basis or supporting facts.
The core of your argument is this:
Well that's the thing. You began that argument with IF. IF the alcoholic is staying sober
as a result of practicing Buchmanism. And the truth is, A.A. does not work, and it
does not increase the rate of sobriety in alcoholics. In fact,
A.A. raises the death
rate instead.
And those facts came from one of the leaders of Alcoholics Anonymous:
Prof. Dr. George E. Vaillant, who is (or was) a member of the Board of
Trustees of Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc., not to mention one of
the biggest promoters of A.A. on the planet Earth.
Dr. Vaillant spent 8 years testing A.A. and trying to prove that A.A.
works, and all that he accomplished was proving that A.A. raises
the death rate in alcoholics.
Also, A.A. does not offer any "tools".
The mind-bending cult practices
that Frank Buchman taught
to William Wilson and Dr. Robert Smith are not "tools",
they are cult recruiting and indoctrination practices.
(Bill Wilson was, of course, using the name of Sam Shoemaker as the leader of the
Oxford Group because Bill was hiding the name of Frank Buchman, whom the American
and British people roundly hated for
his praise of Adolf Hitler
and the Nazis, and his
draft-dodging, Nazi-helping ways.)
Lastly, I love this line:
I have heard of that line being attributed to Bill Wilson in an interview that Bill gave,
but have never found it documented.
I like that line because it clearly reveals a mind that has lost any rationality and
sense of proportion, and has degenerated into extreme black and white thinking:
"The Steps never fail; people fail the Steps!"
(Which is also an example of an
antimetabole.)
Have a good day.
== Orange
Gary Johnson shared a link on your Wall. Stanton Peele was on Blog Talk Radio last night speaking about the AA monopoly on addiction treatment and the failure of the 12 step approach: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/harm-reduction/2011/03/04/stanton-peele-on-addiction-in-the-real-world
Stanton Peele on Addiction in the Real World
This is also encouraging: http://amyleecoy.com/blog/2011/02/15/wildest-dreams-come-true-outta-my-way-aa/
Wildest Dreams Do Come True? Outta My Way AA | Beyond Rehab
WOW! http://www.opednews.com/articles/The-Authoritarianism-of-Dr-by-Amy-Lee-Coy-110303-104.html http://amyleecoy.com/blog/2011/02/15/wildest-dreams-come-true-outta-my-way-aa/ I got this on a link over at the Stinkin Thinkin blog. I am getting the feeling that thanks to the pioneering efforts of yourself, Dr. Peele and others that there are major breakthroughs on the horizon. I agree with you that the Charlie Sheen episode is something we should approach with caution, but it has opened some avenues to discuss things like the 5% success rate of AA. G.
Hi Gary,
Thanks for the links. Those are great. I've already added Amy Lee Coy to my list of links.
It was really good to hear Stanton Peele speaking, and it gave me more perspective on
the whole Charlie Sheen thing. I didn't know that Martin Sheen, Charlie's father,
was a committed 12-Stepper who has been shoving Charlie into A.A. all of his life.
No wonder Charlie screams about the Step Nazis.
And no wonder there were so many plugs for A.A. in The West Wing. (I was just talking
about that
in a previous letter, here.)
Thanks again for the links, and have a good day now.
== Orange
hello . I am a member of NA in Iran . I am reading your website and I agree with some of them . i am clean for about 4 years and never work or do 12 steps completely cos i didn't like . I just joined meetings but 12 steps is not all about sin or god . there are many important things for life in steps . for example step 1 says I should never use any drugs for my entire life . step 2 says I should consult with others and get information and experiences for a good decision . step 3 says I should move and do my best and ... its more deeper than the first looking . bye .
Hello Esm,
Thank you for the letter. Congratulations on your years of clean and sober living.
I'm glad to hear that you accomplished it without the 12 Steps. I don't
blame you for not liking them.
You seem to have your own private interpretation of the 12 Steps.
Step 1 actually says that we are powerless over our addictions. It doesn't really say that
we should not take drugs — it just says that we are powerless over our addictions,
and our life is unmanageable.
Step 2 does not say that we should consult with others. It says that we came to believe
that a "Higher Power" (like Allah) will restore us to sanity. So you are confessing that
you are insane, but you believe that a supernatural being will fix your brain for you.
(But since you are insane, so are your beliefs. What is that worth?)
And Step 3 says that you should surrender your will and your life to "God". Maybe this is
reworded in Iran to say "Allah". Is it?
Then Step Four says that you must start listing and confessing your sins.
Yes, sins. All of those "wrongs" and "moral shortcomings",
and "defects of character" are really sins.
Bill Wilson clearly said so in his second book, "Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions"
Now I'm really glad that you didn't do any of that 12-Step stuff and mess up your mind.
Have a good life now.
== Orange
[The next letter from Esm is here.]
Just before my 9th year sober anniversary I left AA. Two years ago I was so depressed and confused that I decided to get outside help and found a good therapist to address my "outside" issues. it was the best thing I have ever done. once I had a way of reframing my thoughts with a trained mental health professional the grip of the nonsense of AA slogans and group think was lessened. After awhile what people said in meetings started to sound like repetitive rote recitations of rote stock phrases, and it started to dawn on me that while I was changing for the better the people around me ( especially the old-timers) stayed the same. The final straw was when in one of the last meetings I went to one of the (self appointed) old-timer guru sat next to me and instead of having a normal conversation with me I saw that all he said was mindless superficial spiritual claptrap instead of rational discourse (how about simple polite conversation). I looked right through him and realized I was hopelessly surrounded by very sick people who have no solution for me. So as of today I am 5 days recovered from cultism, guruism and believe that it is my will to be healthy and my rational mind that wants to be better not some spiritual mumbo jumbo. My mantra now is: if I have a health problem I go to a doctor, if I have a mental health problem I go to a mental health professional, and I do not turn to spiritual or religious groups for solution to those problems. I am still struggling to deprogram myself and would love some tips. The fear that is planted that I will die if I leave AA or drink again is very strong. Also should I cut off all ties with even people I liked? A part of me says to stay away from all contact because even well intentioned people in AA are very sick. I am in therapy with a good CB practitioner and don't plan on leaving until I finish working on getting over medical phobias. I do not yet know how much any underlying medical conditions may be contributing to what I used to call my alcoholism. you have my permission to post this letter because i found it helpful to read stories similar to my own on your site. Mike
Hello Mike,
Thank you for the letter and congratulations on your years of sobriety, and your newfound
freedom and sanity.
Starting with the last item, I don't think that you need to cut all ties with former friends
or acquaintances in A.A. (That is actually what cults make members do, to prevent them
from learning anything negative about the cult.)
The thing is, you have "seen the light". You described your moment of enlightenment quite
well — how you suddenly saw through the oldtimer and realized that he was just a sick
man repeating slogans, not a wise old man imparting holy wisdom.
Years ago, somebody commented that "Once the little light bulb goes
on in your head, it's all over." Yes. You can't get sucked back into
believing their nonsense again, because you know too much now.
Continuing to associate with those sick people may be a little depressing.
And I wouldn't take too heavy of a dose of it. Undoubtedly, they will try to
convince you that you are wrong and they are right about everything, and you
are doomed to die drunk in a gutter for leaving A.A. That can be irritating
and frustrating. But on the other
hand, you might be able to inject a note of sanity into the jabber and
help somebody else out of the darkness. Admittedly, most of them don't
want out, they don't want to know the truth, but somebody might.
About deprogramming: I wrote a web page about that, here:
How To Deprogram Your Own Mind.
That is just some ideas that I wrote down. You might find some helpful techniques
there.
Beyond that, I would suggest that you keep on learning, and keep your eyes and
ears open and see when somebody is trying to foist unsubstantiated bull on you. — And
irrational thoughts, and myths. In particular, the
Cult Test
and
Propaganda Techniques
web pages are good ones for detecting mind games and misinformation tricks.
Each time you recognize that somebody is trying to foist some untrue baloney on you,
it loses its power over you.
About myths: A.A. thrives on myths, like the myth that millions of people have gotten sober
and live happy lives by doing Frank Buchman's cult practices. And that Bill Wilson was
a Holy Messenger who got the Steps straight from God — after he had a Religious Experience
and saw God.
And that doing the 12 Steps will make you spiritual and get you closer to God.
And that leaving A.A. equals relapsing and dying.
Coincidentally, I was just reading a book about the future decline of the Industrial Age,
and the author stated that our views and expectations of the future are
colored by our only-slightly-veiled mythology:
Most ancient cultures took their myths directly from their religious ideas,
using traditional stories about the gods and goddesses to make sense
of their world. Our society does the same thing in a hole-and-corner way,
dressing up an assortment of old religious ideas in the more fashionable
garments of scientific theory or political ideology. Still, scratch the
most up-to-date modern world-view or the most casually held popular opinion,
and anyone with a nodding aquaintance with traditional myths will recognize
the underlying story at a glance.
You mentioned one common myth in your fears: Some bad people
abandoned the Right Religion and started worshipping a false god (like a Golden Calf or Baal),
so an angry God destroyed them.
A.A. uses the same myth to instill fear in members: If you leave this religion,
and stop doing the Holy Practices (that Bill Wilson got from God), you will be destroyed.
(Of course, they also insist that their religion is not a religion, but that's a different
debate.)
Another myth is the story of Icarus, who was punished for hubris and wrecklessness
and over-reaching.
He tried to fly too high, and fell to his death. Similarly, A.A. says that if you
are so "egotistical" as to think that you can live without A.A.,
you will fall to your death.
And if you are so "vain" that you think you are saner and smarter
than a sad old-timer who spends his life parrotting slogans, you will fall to your death.
(So it's better to play it safe and remain a humble slave.)
A myth that the Steppers do not mention, but that I find very appropriate, is the
story of Dr. Faustus, who sold his soul to the Devil in trade for power
over this world. That is just like
a Stepper who sells his soul to the Devil in trade
for sobriety.
I imagine that you have seen
the Cult Test question
and
answer about
The Cult Implants Phobias. Those things list many of the standard fears and
phobias. Just looking at them, and seeing how someone worked at instilling those
fears in you can help to undermine the fear. Keep looking at them and refuting them
and they will lose their hold over you.
And if it will help any, remember that there are millions of us who stay
sober without practicing any cult religion, or going to any
"support group" meetings. Many millions. Far more than the number of
people who stay sober in A.A.
The Harvard Medical School
reported that 80% of the successful sober people do it alone, on their own,
without any treatment or "support group".
That is the vast majority, and that alone proves that the A.A. fear-mongering is false.
Have a good day and a good life now.
== Orange
[There are two responses to this letter, here and here.
Subject: Virginia Ironside: 'Why I gave up alcohol' — Healthy Living, Health & Families. "dont know if uv seen this orange interesting"
Hello Jillian,
Yes, thank you for that link. That's good. That gets added to the list.
Have a good day now.
== Orange
[The story of Carmen continues here.]
Hey Orange, I am about a year sober right now. Maybe two and a half years ago, my best friend joined AA and quit. I went to a few meetings with him back then. I absolutely hated AA. I thought it was dull. I thought that when I spoke, people either ignored me or condescended towards me. I also thought its program was irrational and made no sense. It also did not help me stay sober. I would sit at my computer for hours, reading the Orange Papers and drinking, and thinking about how much I didn't want to go to AA. At the time, in my few rational moments (I was really not doing well back then), I thought about how screwed up it was to be using this site in order to justify continuing drinking (when that is clearly not its purpose). After I graduated college, I started experimenting with longer and longer periods of sobriety: one month, six weeks, two months, etc. About a year ago, after a pretty bad weekend bender, I finally decided to quit for good. I wrote my best friend a letter about why I was going to do it without AA. And then I did. I went to my first AA meeting since quitting on the first year anniversary of my quit date. The secretary of the meeting had just relapsed, and the people in the meeting went around the room talking about their relapses after 3, 4, 6, and even 20 years of sobriety. I was like, "Uhh, what exactly did these people gain from these meetings, if they relapsed?" Right now I am in the midst of quitting smoking. I'm about 48 hours in. I am struck by how similar it is to quitting drinking. Really, neither was ever a moral failing. They were just addictions. And quitting them didn't require a huge change in my life. It only required abstinence and ignoring the cravings. It's weird to be one of the "spontaneous remissions" that you write about, because I have to pretend that quitting drinking was either hard or not that big of a deal. In truth, it was both easier than I thought it would be, and a huge deal. Every aspect of my life is immeasurably better. Most days I don't think of drinking at all. I don't really fear a relapse, though I firmly intend to never drink a drop again. I look at my friend, who went the AA route, and sometimes I think that my life is much better than his. He thinks about drinking all the time, while I never think about it. He fantasizes about all the great stuff he'll do if he relapses (like try heroin). If I relapse, I hope I'll quit again as soon as possible. I don't know, maybe if I went to AA, I would have recovered sooner, and be happier now. I am glad that everything turned out all right to me. And I am grateful to your site, because... back when I hated AA and was looking for info on how to quit drinking... this was really the only site that confirmed for me that something was wrong. Somehow, back then, it felt very important to have some kind of rational basis for quitting drinking... to understand what was going on... and to feel in control, somehow. This site started to convince me that there was. I haven't actually visited your site since the day I quit. I think I am only back on it now because I am quitting smoking, but I thought I'd write you a letter, even though I think mine is kind of low in content.
Sincerely, P.S. If you publish this, can you please redact my whole name? A native-English speaker named XX who is a recovering alcoholic is not that common, and I'd prefer for this letter not to lead back to me.
Hello, XX,
Okay, your name is gone. Thanks for a great letter. It really brightened my morning cup of
coffee. And it is not "low in content" at all. It says a lot.
Congratulations on quitting drinking and also quitting smoking. That's wonderful.
I can really relate to this statement:
Yes. Like I was just saying in a recent letter, it isn't just that I have a better quality
of life after quitting smoking and drinking, it's a whole different life.
I do things that I didn't have the energy to do before. I have fun that I was too sick to do before.
It's a very different life, not just a better life.
And I went from the doctor telling me I was going to die if I didn't quit drinking to
having the doctor raving about how good all of my medical test results are.
No joke. No exaggeration there.
I also noticed how similar quitting smoking and quitting drinking was. I had the same stupid
little
Lizard Brain Addiction Monster
yammering his lines about how "We can just have one now", no matter
whether "one" meant one drink or one cigarette.
What I learned from fighting with him over quitting smoking so many times helped me when
it came to quitting drinking.
Have a good day and a good life now.
== Orange
Date: Sat, March 5, 2011 4:41 pm (answered 14 March 2011) [RE:]
Yes, the ban on anger is just another part of the mind-control program. Don't trust your own mind. Don't feel your own feelings. Don't have a resentment at people screwing you over. I LOVE THAT!!! Orange you always make me laugh. Speaking of anger. AA taught me not to be angry, anger was only for NORMAL folks. Unfortunately living without anger means living without feeling. Eventually I lost the ability to feel compassion or joy. I couldn't feel sad without feeling bad. Not feeling anything was the only way I could survive, It harmed my marriage, and the relationships I had with my children and my family. I had no friends outside of AA anymore, so I did not even know HOW to be a friend to any.... one. AA kills it all. Thank God..... I can laugh again.... feel again..... and STILL stay angry at AA. Now I finally feel alive, and it feels so very wonderful.
Take Care....
Hi again, Renee,
Thanks for the letter. I'm glad to hear that you are feeling better.
Have a good day now.
== Orange
[The next letter from Renee_C is here.]
You say you writing the truth about AA, How can you, you don't know the truth!
Hi Gene,
Would you care to tell us "the truth" that I supposedly do not know?
Would you care to tell us the truth about
the Oxford
Group that created all of the practices that make up the 12 Steps?
Would you care to tell us the truth about
the A.A. success
or failure rate in sobering up alcoholics?
Would you care to tell us the truth about
the A.A. death rate?
Please be very specific with the facts, and please list where you get your facts from.
Thank you, and have a good day.
== Orange
Last updated 8 March 2013. |
